There's a fellow from the Church of God going door to door in our little town spreading the gospel (as they see the gospel) and drumming up membership. The United Church of God is a non-Christian cult that denies the Trinity, the true divinity of Christ, and requires both baptism and obedience to the commandments to be saved.
He's a nice enough guy and if he really feels a need to worship on Saturday, that's fine by me, and we have had a couple of interesting conversations, but his being a member of a works based anti-Trinitarian cult kind of saddens me. In our last conversation I tried not to look shocked when he said "There's some churches around here that call themselves protestant but they actually believe in [in a conspiratorial whisper] salvation by faith alone"
REALLY? How dare they!
I still chuckle that he said that to me. If it wasn't for sola fide we'd all still be depending on man made 'sacraments' for salvation. It's clear that his armstrongian cult is cherry picking the bible to back up their allegations, and any verse I had to refute his theory of sola opus was answered with "That's not what that means" then he'd dance off to another favored verse.
The main point that Mr. C.O.G. hammers on is water baptism. To me it sounded like the most important thing in his spiritual life is being a "full dunker". To be honest his insistence on Water Baptism Ueber Alles is starting to creep me out, primarily because he draws a blank when you mention Spiritual Baptism.
He's a nice enough guy and if he really feels a need to worship on Saturday, that's fine by me, and we have had a couple of interesting conversations, but his being a member of a works based anti-Trinitarian cult kind of saddens me. In our last conversation I tried not to look shocked when he said "There's some churches around here that call themselves protestant but they actually believe in [in a conspiratorial whisper] salvation by faith alone"
REALLY? How dare they!
I still chuckle that he said that to me. If it wasn't for sola fide we'd all still be depending on man made 'sacraments' for salvation. It's clear that his armstrongian cult is cherry picking the bible to back up their allegations, and any verse I had to refute his theory of sola opus was answered with "That's not what that means" then he'd dance off to another favored verse.
The main point that Mr. C.O.G. hammers on is water baptism. To me it sounded like the most important thing in his spiritual life is being a "full dunker". To be honest his insistence on Water Baptism Ueber Alles is starting to creep me out, primarily because he draws a blank when you mention Spiritual Baptism.
For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not in cleverness of speech, so that the cross of Christ would not be made void (1 Corinthians 1:17)
Excellent video commentary. Thanks for digging that one up.
ReplyDeleteDoug this is such an area of confusion and division for people. I kind of understand it, and kind of don't.
ReplyDeleteOn the point your neighbor is making, one must be baptized to be saved, we know from the Scriptures that this is false. Luke 23.42 No doubt you tried to bring this to his attention with no result!
A case can be made that there are two sacraments which are not man made - the Lord's supper and baptism. Christians are explicitly commanded to observe these two. I agree with you that anything beyond these two are man-made and potentially dangerous to faith.
sacrament: In theology, an outward and visible sign of inward and spiritual grace; more particularly, a solemn religious ceremony enjoined by Christ. -Century dictionary
Why wouldn't a Christian be baptized? I've met professing Christians who are not baptized and find such refusal strange.
In terms of manner of baptism and whether or not to baptize the children of believers, Christians have come to different ideas on these things for two millennia.
Lord help us!
The gang at WWUTT do such an incredible job piecing together these videos that explain sometimes confusing concepts. Their rule of thumb "when we understand the text" is true, rather than relying on the flawed wisdom of man all we need to do is read what God told us.
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